What's so surprising about Burkland? That he is #2 RG or that he is on the chart at all given the retirement rumor? I'm not surprised by the former as he was never more than a mediocre backup.

I still think this teams biggest problem has been and continues to be the offensive line which to me says a lot given the issues we had w/ several offensive skill positions last year. Riley being listed as the #1 RB is also a big problem - hope he turns out to be the next Mike Alstott.

Spartanmack said:

What's so surprising about Burkland? That he is #2 RG or that he is on the chart at all given the retirement rumor? I'm not surprised by the former as he was never more than a mediocre backup.

I still think this teams biggest problem has been and continues to be the offensive line which to me says a lot given the issues we had w/ several offensive skill positions last year. Riley being listed as the #1 RB is also a big problem - hope he turns out to be the next Mike Alstott.

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surprising to see him on there given the injuries.

as for Riley, I really hope that Holmes comes in and establishes himself as the power back, like Bell did 3 seasons ago. you could then move Riley back to his original position, we have Owens coming in 2014 as another power guy. almost 100% sure that Shelton and Williams red shirt. I think there's a good chance that Williams ends up as a WR given attrition and position shifts now.

saw a tweet about holmes yesterday, benched 225 23 times, very good for a true freshman RB. his dad is a personal trainer so i'm not surprised, he could be the guy.

Sbee said:

some interesting things there, Jarius Jones OR Taiwan Jones at the star, burkland as 2 right tackle. the big surprise I guess is Riley bullough as starting RB with Nick Hill as #2. the chart doesn't include freshmen so no Reshke or Holmes.

I think we're a better team with Holmes at the RB spot and Bullough back at LB. Hill will get carries no matter what, MD wants a speed guy and a power guy.

dantonio said in an interview that he was using the depth chart to motivate Taiwan jones

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What is so surprising about Bullough at RB? Dantonio listed him as the favorite coming out of spring camp. I'm not sure it's a great sign for your team. I doubt that Bullough is at RB because Dantonio really wanted him to be there. I think he's there out of necessity because your other RB's aren't producing.

As for Holmes, I'm not sure how you can make that statement. How do you know if you're a better team with Holmes at RB and Bullough at LB? Holmes is a 3 star recruit with MAC offers. I'm not saying he can't turn into something, but it's highly unlikely, even rare, that a freshman like that comes in and produces. Bullough has been practicing at RB for the past 6 months and probably is far more acclimated with the offense - not to mention, is not a freshman.

It's hard for me to see a scenario where MSU's offense improves this year given what MSU lost vs. what they replace them with. I think any improvement Maxwell makes will be negated by the decline at other positions; especially RB.

MAIZEandBLUE09 said:

What is so surprising about Bullough at RB? Dantonio listed him as the favorite coming out of spring camp. I'm not sure it's a great sign for your team. I doubt that Bullough is at RB because Dantonio really wanted him to be there. I think he's there out of necessity because your other RB's aren't producing.

As for Holmes, I'm not sure how you can make that statement. How do you know if you're a better team with Holmes at RB and Bullough at LB? Holmes is a 3 star recruit with MAC offers. I'm not saying he can't turn into something, but it's highly unlikely, even rare, that a freshman like that comes in and produces. Bullough has been practicing at RB for the past 6 months and probably is far more acclimated with the offense - not to mention, is not a freshman.

It's hard for me to see a scenario where MSU's offense improves this year given what MSU lost vs. what they replace them with. I think any improvement Maxwell makes will be negated by the decline at other positions; especially RB.

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the concerning thing about the offense is that nobody really separates themselves from the rest as being the #1. I think burbridge has done this at WR but QB, RB, TE are all up in the air, not a great feeling.

bullough at RB means that he's not backing up on defense which means that we need to burn a red shirt on Reshke or Shane Jones. MD hates backing up a senior with a senior, Riley on defense gives us another year for one of those LB's coming in.

as for holmes, I've liked what I read about him. i'm not too concerned with stars, of course it's better to get more highly rated guys overall but 3 stars don't make me discount a player. that's the UM mentality but in reality, we've seen 4 star RB's never do much like Larry Caper. Leveon bell had offers from Marshall, BGSU, and EMU. Ringer was a 3 star as well but had offers from FLA and USC, a little different. i'd love to have a stud 5 star coming in but I still think holmes is in the mix.

Hearing great things about Holmes. He's a man child. O line has depth, but only if they can finally stay healthy. Henry Conway has been making waves this summer. The defense is absolutely stacked and as deep as we've ever had in East Lansing. Taiwan Jones is a beast, but he has to be able to cover guys on 3rd down, at 6-3, 250 he can run like the wind, but needs to still work on his coverage.

Don't put a ton of stock into 40 times, but Coach D said Trae Waynes has been running 4.32, kid has the size, speed and the fluid hips to be the best cover corner MD has brought in. The depth at safety and LB is staggering. DT should be better and deep this year too, Lawrence Thomas is going to be a force there as a backup. You need 4 or 5 good DTs to control the line of scrimmage, the only question is James Kittridge, who was disruptive last season, had hernia surgery and lost some weight. He's back to 100%, but still down 25 pound from where we'd like him to play. Shilique Calhoun is going to have a breakout season, I predict 9+ sacks, he was already a better pass rusher than Gholston last year, with the added weight I hope he can hold the edge against the run.

Offensively, people worry about TE and RB, but when's the last time MSU didn't have stud RBs and TEs? Can't remember. Word is that Burbridge is a beast, Mumphreys and Lippett will be solid, but that Arnett is much improved and will have a good season. Monty Madaris is ready to contribute too. As I said the O line is a strength and quite deep. It's all about Maxwell. If we get decent QB play, and better red zone play calling the team will have a great season.

My breakout players:
Shilique Calhoun DE, Blake Treadwell OG(Finally healthy), Trae Waynes CB, and DeAnthony Arnett WR.

Maize - Riley being on top of the depth chart is a disappointment, not a surprise. Sbee as far as TB is concerned as much as I enjoyed watching Ringer my favorite Spartan tailbacks have always been guys like TJ Ducket and the under-utilized Jehuu Caulcrick so if we're developing a stable of power backs I'm cool with that. That said, I'd still wish Nick Hill would have developed more over the last few years and been ahead of a converted LB in the depth chart as I don't expect Riley to be anything like TJ, Jehuu. LeVeon, etc.

Johnny, lots of people said the o-line was a strength this time last year. I said it was nuts then and I think it's crazy now - with the possible exception of Blake Treadwell, they're a bunch of mediocre starters and bad backups. Other than Burbridge, I don't really share your enthusiasm for the offensive skill guys either. Hopefully Maxwell can put last year behind him but i fear his confidence is shaken. Add that to his limited skill set (strong arm but just doesn't seem to get it) and he could be hearing fans call for Cook or O'Connor by October.

Looking forward to watching this defense but tempering my expectations for the rest of team.

Spartanmack said:

Maize - Riley being on top of the depth chart is a disappointment, not a surprise. Sbee as far as TB is concerned as much as I enjoyed watching Ringer my favorite Spartan tailbacks have always been guys like TJ Ducket and the under-utilized Jehuu Caulcrick so if we're developing a stable of power backs I'm cool with that. That said, I'd still wish Nick Hill would have developed more over the last few years and been ahead of a converted LB in the depth chart as I don't expect Riley to be anything like TJ, Jehuu. LeVeon, etc.

Johnny, lots of people said the o-line was a strength this time last year. I said it was nuts then and I think it's crazy now - with the possible exception of Blake Treadwell, they're a bunch of mediocre starters and bad backups. Other than Burbridge, I don't really share your enthusiasm for the offensive skill guys either. Hopefully Maxwell can put last year behind him but i fear his confidence is shaken. Add that to his limited skill set (strong arm but just doesn't seem to get it) and he could be hearing fans call for Cook or O'Connor by October.

Looking forward to watching this defense but tempering my expectations for the rest of team.

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Disagree on the O line, Fou Fonotu allowed 1 sack total in 2011, he's one of the best pass blocking tackles in college football. Jackson was a freshman All American in 2011 as was Jack Allen in 2012. As you said Treadwell is good. France has been average at best though. Burkland showed flashes, but was alos bad at times and he's always hurt. Donavon Clark and Henry Conway are talented backups. It's an experienced group, they just need to stay healthy. The injuries on the O line the last 4 years have been insane. There's actually been plenty of talent brought in, just never stayed healthy. Give them one season of normal; O line health and they will gel.

johnny2x2x said:

Disagree on the O line, Fou Fonotu allowed 1 sack total in 2011, he's one of the best pass blocking tackles in college football. Jackson was a freshman All American in 2011 as was Jack Allen in 2012. As you said Treadwell is good. France has been average at best though. Burkland showed flashes, but was alos bad at times and he's always hurt. Donavon Clark and Henry Conway are talented backups. It's an experienced group, they just need to stay healthy. The injuries on the O line the last 4 years have been insane. There's actually been plenty of talent brought in, just never stayed healthy. Give them one season of normal; O line health and they will gel.

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clark actually looked serviceable when he was thrown into action for the Michigan game. if we can stay healthy on OL I think our offense will be a lot better. we played down 2 OL and some games down 3 along with Sims. You'd have to believe we would have beaten Iowa and Michigan with a healthy Sims.

Burkland was terrible - almost got Maxwell killed last year. Given the limited number of freshman that start on the OL I don't put a lot of stock in freshman conf or AA honors esp considering how bad the line was last year. As for Funoti, I think he's overrated. We didn't face many good defenses in 2011 and our offense was much more dynamic then. One thing the line does have going for them is we don't face many good defenses again this year. Unfortunately, we don't have the skill position players we had in 2010/11 and are likely to be more 1-dimensional again.

our slogan should be

"MSU 2013, our offense can't be much worse....or can it?"

I do like what I've read about Geiger having the inside track for the kicking job. we missed a lot of easy fg's last year, of course nobody is going to be perfect but we lost a lot of close games with missed FG's.

It is discouraging to see Riley as our go to RB, especially since he wasn't recruited for that position. Do we have the same RB's coach now that we have had since Dantonio arrived ? We have had some good RB's roll through here lately, what happened in our RB recruiting ? We got away from players like Bell, signing smaller faster guys. The last two years we are going for that type of player again with holmes and that kid out of Maryland. Is this a problem caused by our Oline ? Do we have to have bigger RB's, guys who fall forward, because or line can't create holes for the smaller faster guys ?

Sbee said:

our slogan should be

"MSU 2013, our offense can't be much worse....or can it?"

I do like what I've read about Geiger having the inside track for the kicking job. we missed a lot of easy fg's last year, of course nobody is going to be perfect but we lost a lot of close games with missed FG's.

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Our offense scares me soooo much. I'm affraid we will see the same shit show we saw last year. I'm trying to be optimistic until our first game, but it really is hard to do.

Green and White 95 said:

It is discouraging to see Riley as our go to RB, especially since he wasn't recruited for that position. Do we have the same RB's coach now that we have had since Dantonio arrived ? We have had some good RB's roll through here lately, what happened in our RB recruiting ? We got away from players like Bell, signing smaller faster guys. The last two years we are going for that type of player again with holmes and that kid out of Maryland. Is this a problem caused by our Oline ? Do we have to have bigger RB's, guys who fall forward, because or line can't create holes for the smaller faster guys ?

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we have a mix of speed and power backs. Tompkins and hill are both burners, same with Langford. owens, holmes, bullough are all power guys. Shelton is a smaller back too.

Green and White 95 said:

Our offense scares me soooo much. I'm affraid we will see the same shit show we saw last year. I'm trying to be optimistic until our first game, but it really is hard to do.

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like I said, it can't be much worse

Sbee said:

we have a mix of speed and power backs. Tompkins and hill are both burners, same with Langford. owens, holmes, bullough are all power guys. Shelton is a smaller back too.

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Our speed guys aren't getting the nod though. Is this a direct correalation to a shitty run blocking Oline or are we just recruiting poor speed players. I personally think our Oline is the problem.