And the alternative?

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]So Ron Paul wants to legalize all drugs. Not just marijuana, but ALL drugs. I was in an argument with a paul supporter that told me, "Legalizing drugs wouldn't destroy America. It would kill the underground drug economy and make us all safer." That's an exact quote.

Click to expand...

That's a basic libertarian idea, it's been a fundamental tenet of libertarianism long before anybody ever heard of Ron Paul.

People who believe that believe it because they believe it; they don't believe it because they just blindly follow Ron Paul.

While Jesse Ventura was the Governor of Minnesota, he was being interviewed on a major show; This Week, maybe, or something, and he expressed that he believed that drugs should be legalized.

When asked about all the "damage" it would do he answered, "well, if drugs were legalized tomorrow, I don't think that people who aren't already using them will suddenly go out and start - I won't; will you?"

Seemed like a pretty lucid point to me.

the Liberal Party in Canada just voted at their last convention they want to legalize weed in Canada...they're going to run on it in their major platform next election.

SLICK said:

the Liberal Party in Canada just voted at their last convention they want to legalize weed in Canada...they're going to run on it in their major platform next election.

Click to expand...

Have fun crossing the border...*latex snap*.

SLICK said:

the Liberal Party in Canada just voted at their last convention they want to legalize weed in Canada...they're going to run on it in their major platform next election.

Click to expand...

I have no problem with that. I don't see a huge difference between weed and cigarettes.

But to say that crack or meth could be used legally and that more people won't try it....seriously? Sorry, but there was a huge underground during prohibition, but the number of drinkers wasn't nearly what it was after it became legal again.

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]

SLICK said:

the Liberal Party in Canada just voted at their last convention they want to legalize weed in Canada...they're going to run on it in their major platform next election.

Click to expand...

I have no problem with that. I don't see a huge difference between weed and cigarettes.

But to say that crack or meth could be used legally and that more people won't try it....seriously? Sorry, but there was a huge underground during prohibition, but the number of drinkers wasn't nearly what it was after it became legal again.

Click to expand...

What about decriminalization as opposed to buying your heroin at the local gas bar along with Cheetos and a Mr. Pibb? More or less palatable, or the same?

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]

SLICK said:

the Liberal Party in Canada just voted at their last convention they want to legalize weed in Canada...they're going to run on it in their major platform next election.

Click to expand...

I have no problem with that. I don't see a huge difference between weed and cigarettes.

But to say that crack or meth could be used legally and that more people won't try it....seriously? Sorry, but there was a huge underground during prohibition, but the number of drinkers wasn't nearly what it was after it became legal again.

Click to expand...

And, as we see, that increase destroyed America...

[color=#551A8B said:

TinselWolverine[/color]]
[quote="Monster ":xlvtuxqv]

I have no problem with that. I don't see a huge difference between weed and cigarettes.

But to say that crack or meth could be used legally and that more people won't try it....seriously? Sorry, but there was a huge underground during prohibition, but the number of drinkers wasn't nearly what it was after it became legal again.

Click to expand...

And, as we see, that increase destroyed America...[/quote:xlvtuxqv]

I've known many drunks in my lifetime and rarely did i have to worry about them stealing from me or having a complete mental breakdown and running away because, "They're after me."

I have known and worked with a couple of addicts though. I lived with someone who was supposed to be a former addict, but he got caught up again and robbed another friend's apartment. That same friend pimped out his girlfriend to make money for his addiction.

An employee of mine started missing work. Nobody could get in touch with him for weeks. Finally his mom called us to inform us that he was tweaking bad, they found him on his way to mexico, crying about how some people were trying to kill him and he had to get out of the country. He hadn't eaten in almost a week and he smelled like puke and shit.

Give me a world full of drunks any day before half a world full of addicts.

isn't a drunk an addict ? or are we just splitting hairs now

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]So Ron Paul wants to legalize all drugs. Not just marijuana, but ALL drugs. I was in an argument with a paul supporter that told me, "Legalizing drugs wouldn't destroy America. It would kill the underground drug economy and make us all safer." That's an exact quote.

This makes me realize how truly blind these supporters are.

Click to expand...

Ron Paul wants to decriminilize drugs the Federal level, and leave the states to determine them. Not at all the same as "legalizing" them. Seems that you and your Paul supporter were bickering over a straw issue.

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]
[quote="TinselWolverine":kg42klvs]

And, as we see, that increase destroyed America...

Click to expand...

I've known many drunks in my lifetime and rarely did i have to worry about them stealing from me or having a complete mental breakdown and running away because, "They're after me."

I have known and worked with a couple of addicts though. I lived with someone who was supposed to be a former addict, but he got caught up again and robbed another friend's apartment. That same friend pimped out his girlfriend to make money for his addiction.

An employee of mine started missing work. Nobody could get in touch with him for weeks. Finally his mom called us to inform us that he was tweaking bad, they found him on his way to mexico, crying about how some people were trying to kill him and he had to get out of the country. He hadn't eaten in almost a week and he smelled like puke and shit.

Give me a world full of drunks any day before half a world full of addicts. [/quote:kg42klvs]

I fail to see how the legality of drugs would have effected the outcome of those you have mentioned. Drug addicts will become drug addicts regardless of whether something is illegal. And as for the robbery, someone who is conducting one criminal act (drug use) is now willing to commit another? Shocked. The money spent on the drug war since the 80s could put those people in rehab 100 times over. It is a failed policy, just as prohibition of alcohol was.

You have to prove to me that non-drug addicts will suddenly become drug addicts once drugs are decriminalized.

Ron paul doesn't have a snowballs chance in hell at becoming POTUS...so it's a pretty much a thread going nowhere.

Keep polling 2 or 3 in primaries and high with independents and it might open up some GOP platform space for his ideals. But yeah, legalization of drugs won't be one of those ideals.

cheeno said:

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]

I've known many drunks in my lifetime and rarely did i have to worry about them stealing from me or having a complete mental breakdown and running away because, "They're after me."

I have known and worked with a couple of addicts though. I lived with someone who was supposed to be a former addict, but he got caught up again and robbed another friend's apartment. That same friend pimped out his girlfriend to make money for his addiction.

An employee of mine started missing work. Nobody could get in touch with him for weeks. Finally his mom called us to inform us that he was tweaking bad, they found him on his way to mexico, crying about how some people were trying to kill him and he had to get out of the country. He hadn't eaten in almost a week and he smelled like puke and shit.

Give me a world full of drunks any day before half a world full of addicts.

Click to expand...

I fail to see how the legality of drugs would have effected the outcome of those you have mentioned. Drug addicts will become drug addicts regardless of whether something is illegal. And as for the robbery, someone who is conducting one criminal act (drug use) is now willing to commit another? Shocked. The money spent on the drug war since the 80s could put those people in rehab 100 times over. It is a failed policy, just as prohibition of alcohol was.

You have to prove to me that non-drug addicts will suddenly become drug addicts once drugs are decriminalized.

Click to expand...

what i'm saying is that illegal drugs are much more dangerous than alcohol.

You don't think that something that was once illegal becoming legal would make a lot of people want to try it? You don't think the drug makers are going to advertise? It would happen and it would be bad.

As far as my friend goes, when he was sober, the guy was probably the most trustworthy person I've ever met. He made good money and was saving up to put a deposit on a house. Hung out with one of his old friends, got pressured into using, and that was when he started his downward spiral.

And I forget who said that Paul just wants to let the states decide if the drugs are legal or not, but he's also said that they SHOULD be legal. I know that this would never have a remote chance of happening, but it definitely shows his true self.

You don't think that something that was once illegal becoming legal would make a lot of people want to try it?

Click to expand...

No. Are you going to mainline heroin at the first opportunity after it becomes legal in your state?

You don't think the drug makers are going to advertise? It would happen and it would be bad.

Click to expand...

I'd love to see the ad agency that picks up the "Happy Heroin" account, at the expense of all its other clients. The PR department would have a blast spinning that one. Actually Crispin, Porter and Bogusky would probably leap at the chance, so never mind.

And I forget who said that Paul just wants to let the states decide if the drugs are legal or not, but he's also said that they SHOULD be legal. I know that this would never have a remote chance of happening, but it definitely shows his true self.

Click to expand...

I have never heard Paul make that declaration. Where have you heard of read about it?

Q: You say that the federal government should stay out of people's personal habits, including marijuana, cocaine, even heroin.

A: It's an issue of protecting liberty across the board. If you have the inconsistency, then you're really not defending liberty. We want freedom [including] when it comes to our personal habits.

from the SC primary debate.

sorry, but the guy is out of touch with reality.

[color=#FF6103 said:

Monster [/color]]Q: You say that the federal government should stay out of people's personal habits, including marijuana, cocaine, even heroin.

A: It's an issue of protecting liberty across the board. If you have the inconsistency, then you're really not defending liberty. We want freedom [including] when it comes to our personal habits.

from the SC primary debate.

sorry, but the guy is out of touch with reality.

Click to expand...

No. I think that he just wants to change it. Drug laws do not stop drug addition, and the absence of them will not encourage it either. If government can prohibit drug use, it can prohibit a lot of other things as well. I don't need the Federal government to legislate the obvious to me. It's the people who think that they need the government to guide their behavior who are out of touch with reality.

Ron Paul makes a lot of sense in this one.

Portugal did this... note, there's a difference between "legalizing" and "decriminalizing" but this difference is often intentionally obscured by the media, police associations, religious kooks, etc. to skew the debate.

The Authoritarian wack jobs with a vested interest in seeing our drug policies continued* spin the decision as being between Law and Order on one hand, and a completely drug-fueled anarchy on the other.

the reality is, you may see the same levels of drug addiction that you'd see for alcoholism (which probably wouldn't change much.) Addiction is treated as an illness; you don't get locked up for it, you get sent to court ordered rehab if a judge finds you have a problem. It doesn't destroy your life and force you to become a career criminal like a felony drug conviction does in the U.S.

Portugal's policy has been pretty successful and endorsed by a number of U.S. groups, including some high profile libertarian and political think tanks.

*examples: the police bring it a lot of $$$ through property seizures related to drugs, the for-profit prison industry likes incarceration rates to remain high, and I'm sure the drug cartels themselves have no reason to want the U.S. to decriminalize drugs and cut into their profit margins...

smayschmouthfootball said:

You don't think that something that was once illegal becoming legal would make a lot of people want to try it?

Click to expand...

No. Are you going to mainline heroin at the first opportunity after it becomes legal in your state?

Click to expand...

The minute hairoin gets legal I'm gonna run out and mainline me some....