I have no problem with this provided Ausmus uses him right and he has a short leash in case he starts sucking again. Id be willing to bet that part of his falloff was due to fatigue.

Thumb said:

The problem Tom is you're looking at his season totals. He had a career first half, that inflated those numbers.

And the fact he was 1st in innings pitched is not a good thing, that's on our rookie manager and bonehead Jones.

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I could not agree more. Season stats are deceiving, especially in a sport like baseball. His splits last year were horrific.

Stupid sign... wtf are they thinking? This is gonna be another frustrating year and no playoffs. Indians are gonna win this division.

kalinecountry said:

That is a question for Ausmus, along with all of us knowing they didn't have anyone to step up for him, or the mismanagement of the bullpen with Al-Al not used in those situations.

We really don't have many in the front office that make more sound decisions than foolish ones.

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No one will ask these brand of questions without being ostracized or snubbed.

Byco, I Hope all is well with your Mom.

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She passed away in 2012. I was just making the point. But thanks for asking.

It's kind of like Phil Coke and Don Kelly/Brandon Inge. Every time you think we finally have a chance to cut some dead weight, DD holds the door open a little too long and in July (or sooner) we'll all be saying "Why the fuck did we bring this guy back...AGAIN?"

Not trying to defend Joba, but I don't get all the hate here. It's a 1yr/$1mil deal for a guy who may be able to help out and give us some depth. It's not like he's being presented as the 7th, 8th, or 9th inning solution. If he's crap, oh well. If he's even decent, it will probably end up being a smart signing.

kingofdetroit57 said:

Not trying to defend Joba, but I don't get all the hate here. It's a 1yr/$1mil deal for a guy who may be able to help out and give us some depth. It's not like he's being presented as the 7th, 8th, or 9th inning solution. If he's crap, oh well. If he's even decent, it will probably end up being a smart signing.

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Some guys here complain about every signing.

kingofdetroit57 said:

Not trying to defend Joba, but I don't get all the hate here. It's a 1yr/$1mil deal for a guy who may be able to help out and give us some depth. It's not like he's being presented as the 7th, 8th, or 9th inning solution. If he's crap, oh well. If he's even decent, it will probably end up being a smart signing.

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This.

byco42 said:

No one will ask these brand of questions without being ostracized or snubbed.



She passed away in 2012. I was just making the point. But thanks for asking.

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My heartfelt sympathy.

DD, please develop internal relief help.

DET releases Chad Smith but signs Joba. At this point, Chad Smith could do just as well and cost less.

If we use a decent metric, xFIP, you will see where Joba isn't anything special. ERA, WHIP, Opponent BAVG, etc are fielder dependent and can be skewed by a good or bad defense, hence why I am showing xFIP.

Last 3 years Away xFIP (Tiger relievers from 2015, 2014 and 2013)

J. Soria 1.81
C. Knebel 2.03
B. Rondon 2.49
C. Smith 2.51
D. Downs 2.59
E. Reed 2.78
A. Nesbitt 2.79
J. Benoit 2.85
J. Valdez 2.85
B. Farmer 2.89

J. Nathan 3.00
D. Smyly 3.09
A. Albuquerque 3.13
T. Gorzelanny 3.28
J. Miller 3.32
K. Lobstein 3.40
P. Coke 3.40
K. Whelan 3.45
P. McCoy 3.49
J. Johnson 3.49
L. Putkonen 3.60
A. Simon 3.62
J. Alvarez 3.64
K. Ryan 3.67
I. Krol 3.67
J. Hardy 3.68
B. Villarreal 3.72

J. Veras 3.76
D. VerHagen 3.86
M. Mercedes 3.89
J. Chamberlain 3.93
J. Zeid 3.95
A. Wilson 3.95
R. Ray 3.96

J. Valverde 4.13
J. Ortega 4.31
J. Hanrahan 4.89

BOLD means they are currently on the 40-man roster or non-roster invitee.

Why did we release Chad Smith? Oh yeah, to make room for Joba. And we pick up someone like Zeid, but release or put on waivers the likes Evan Reed or Justin Muller.


The next stat important to relievers is about inherited runners.

Last 3 years (At least 14 inherited runners)

A. Simon 41 IR 8 IS 19.5%
J. Benoit 46 IR 9 IS 19.7%
J. Valverde 14 IR 3 IS 21.4%
J. Veras 62 IR 14 IS 22.6%
E. Reed 25 IR 6 IS 24.0%
O. Dotel 28 IR 7 IS 25.0%
A. Albuquerque 96 IR 30 IS 25.4%
D. Downs 67 IR 18 IS 26.9%
B. Hardy 29 IR 8 IS 27.6%

2014 AL AVG = 28.7

J. Zeid 38 IR 11 IS 28.9%
P. Coke 122 IR 40 IS 32.8%
J. Soria 18 IR 6 IS 33.3%
L. Putkonen 25 IR 9 IS 36.0%

J. Johnson 41 IR 17 IS 41.5%
J. Chamberlain 58 IR 27 IS 46.6%
B. Villarreal 32 IR 15 IS 46.9%
I. Krol 48 IR 23 IS 47.9%
J. Nathan 18 IR 9 IS 50.0%
A. Wilson 25 IR 15 IS 60.0%


Chamberlain had a great 1st half of 2014, but that is not his norm. This would be like wanting Chris Shelton based on his first half of 2006.

And if $1 Mil in salary means nothing, let's sign Phil Coke, Jose Valverde, and Todd Jones and clear roster space by "dumping" our younger relievers. It has worked so well for the organization so far.

Did you forget....He had better offers but wanted to settle some unfinished business in Detroit.

By internal relief are you referring to the farm system?

Developing talent isn't DD's strong suit, the farm system is there for trades (that's why they have one of the worst in MLB). At this point, it is what it is, it's not going to change. They don't groom talent and bring them through the system. And if they do, they end up getting shipped out.

dubbsco said:

By internal relief are you referring to the farm system?

Developing talent isn't DD's strong suit, the farm system is there for trades (that's why they have one of the worst in MLB). At this point, it is what it is, it's not going to change. They don't groom talent and bring them through the system. And if they do, they end up getting shipped out.

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He was pointing out the fact we did not need Joba and took away a roster spot by releasing Smith who could be as effective or better. He was promptly picked up by Oakland. Additionally, we have some young arms that could contribute instead of bringing in retreads no one else wants. I would rather see Wilson or Farmer over Joba.

I honestly just don't give a fuck. Are there other internal options that could have done about the same? Probably, yeah. Does this actually matter that much? Fuck no. Its a $1mil/1yr deal for the 5th RHP in the bullpen that could or could not work out. If it does, good for cheap. If it doesnt, who fucking cares? Cut him and be done with it. Its not worth making a big deal out of, IMO.

Tell me how you really feel

Tigers sign Ryan Perry to a minor league deal today. I see they are still looking at old retreads

swami45 said:

Tigers sign Ryan Perry to a minor league deal today. I see they are still looking at old retreads

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Good God. What are they doing with Perry? Before he left, there was some eye problem he developed. Can't remember if it was taken care of.

They have how many....30 or so pitchers of varying ilk and dreck they will throw against the wall and see which sticks, and bring them up until they fail, and then bring up any of the others toiling with varied success vs. minor league batters.

edit;
http://www.mlive.com/tigers/index.ssf/2015/02/detroit_tigers_bring_back_righ_1.html
Detroit Tigers bring back former first-round pick Ryan Perry on minor league deal. He also had hip surgery.
mlive

Doesn't it seem like every prospect DD trades away he immediately brings back after they fail miserably?

Strange