Joey Votto's insane stat

[manchild98]

I'm sure many of you already heard about this but...how is this possible?


After 6,829 plate appearances Joey Votto popped out to first base for the first time ever. In fact, he's only popped out 8 times in his career.

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/04/17/joey-votto-cincinnati-reds-infield-pop-ups-last-10-seasons

 

[dale675]

Man this is why I get on the internet. That is unreal. LMAO

 

[Mitchrapp]

I read a couple days ago. Unreal.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Where is the line between a line drive and a pop out? What if I batted ball doesn’t go high enough to be classified as a pop up, but isn’t really straight enough to be described as a line drive either?

What about THAT?

 

[kalinecountry]

Where is the line between a line drive and a pop out? What if I batted ball doesn?t go high enough to be classified as a pop up, but isn?t really straight enough to be described as a line drive either?

What about THAT?

They might call it a can of corn.
I don?t know if it?s Green Giant or
Del Monte or Goya.

 

[tinselwolverine]

They might call it a can of corn.
I don?t know if it?s Green Giant or
Del Monte or Goya.

I?ve always understood it to mean a high but easy catch, just like this guy explains-

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=acBeqrgTafw

 

[Mitchrapp]

I never heard of Goya.

 

[tinselwolverine]

I never heard of Goya.

It’s a Latino company.

https://images.app.goo.gl/WMakEDVo9tN5i7zx5

As Latin Americans continue to break into the major leagues in larger and larger numbers, Goya corn will eventually become the can of corn most associated with the idiom.

 

[Mitchrapp]

It?s a Latino company.

https://images.app.goo.gl/WMakEDVo9tN5i7zx5

As Latin Americans continue to break into the major leagues in larger and larger numbers, Goya corn will eventually become the can of corn most associated with the idiom.

Can of Goya does have a ring to it.

 

[Rebbiv]

Fly balls, pop ups and line drives are all subjective of the scorer and differs based on angle of sight to such event by the scorer. Trajectory comes into play. A flat trajectory typical implies a line drive. An arching trajectory typically implies fly/pop out. Infield is typically a pop out. Outfield is typically a fly out. There is a "pop" fly, which usually is referred to as a can of corn, as typically the fielder is "waiting" directly underneath to catch it. Fly outs they might waiting, but it isn't coming straight down from above.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Can of Goya. Can of Goya!

 

[tinselwolverine]

Fly balls, pop ups and line drives are all subjective of the scorer and differs based on angle of sight to such event by the scorer. Trajectory comes into play. A flat trajectory typical implies a line drive. An arching trajectory typically implies fly/pop out. Infield is typically a pop out. Outfield is typically a fly out. There is a "pop" fly, which usually is referred to as a can of corn, as typically the fielder is "waiting" directly underneath to catch it. Fly outs they might waiting, but it isn't coming straight down from above.

I thought any batted ball that is caught by a fielder before hitting the ground for the put out is recorded in the scorebook the same as any other regardless as to how it’s perceived by someone who is describing it for an audience.

EDIT: According to this, any batted ball caught in fair territory before hitting the ground for a putout is recorded as “F” in a scorebook. Terms such as “pop-up” or a “line drive” etc. are terms that are used to describe what is observed for an audience. It also appears that the symbol F applies to put out made by any of the nine fielding positions.

So if this is the case, this would have been the first time that Joey Votto ever recorded an F3 in the official scorebook.

 

[Mitchrapp]

That's because it's easy for them. But a popup is still a popup and a line out is still a line out.

 

[tinselwolverine]

That's because it's easy for them. But a popup is still a popup and a line out is still a line out.

So does this mean conclusively and definitively that Joey Votto has never had a line drive out to first before?

And who is the official arbiter of what is a pop-up and what is a line drive?

The answer is-there isn?t one.

F3 would be official.

Whether it?s a pop-up or whether it?s a line drive would depend on who is ever describing it.

Now, maybe 100% of people who saw the play this thread is about would call it a pop out.

That?s what the author of the article called it.

But officially it?s F3.

 

[Rebbiv]

I thought any batted ball that is caught by a fielder before hitting the ground for the put out is recorded in the scorebook the same as any other regardless as to how it?s perceived by someone who is describing it for an audience.

EDIT: According to this, any batted ball caught in fair territory before hitting the ground for a putout is recorded as ?F? in a scorebook. Terms such as ?pop-up? or a ?line drive? etc. are terms that are used to describe what is observed for an audience. It also appears that the symbol F applies to put out made by any of the nine fielding positions.

So if this is the case, this would have been the first time that Joey Votto ever recorded an F3 in the official scorebook.

Traditionally, you are correct. However, with advanced defensive metrics, how the ball is ruled by the official scorer reflects in certain defensive metrics. You now see things like L3, P3 or F3.

 

[Rebbiv]

So does this mean conclusively and definitively that Joey Votto has never had a line drive out to first before?

And who is the official arbiter of what is a pop-up and what is a line drive?

The answer is-there isn?t one.

F3 would be official.

Whether it?s a pop-up or whether it?s a line drive would depend on who is ever describing it.

Now, maybe 100% of people who saw the play this thread is about would call it a pop out.

That?s what the author of the article called it.

But officially it?s F3.

You are taking this too far. 15 years ago, you are probably talking to the choir. The metrics introduced required updates to how things are scored.

 

[tinselwolverine]

You are taking this too far. 15 years ago, you are probably talking to the choir. The metrics introduced required updates to how things are scored.

Excuse me, but I am the arbiter on when something has been taken too far, and once this has been taken too far I’m going to be the one to let you know.

Kidding aside, I have yet to find something that officially distinguishes any kind of unassisted put out from any other kind.

Now-I would say this has gone far enough at this point.

EDIT: Oops - Sorry I thought I was responding to Mich Rapp. It was meant as a joke to bust his chops.

 

[Rebbiv]

https://www.startwithabook.org/content/pdfs/keepingscore_baseball.pdf

 

[manchild98]

I saw another stat that said the average major leaguer would have popped out 127 times with the same amount of plate appearances....compared to the 8 times Votto has popped out.

 

[Rebbiv]

Career Infield Flyball Percentage

J. Votto 1.1%

N. Castellanos 2.1%

N. Goodrum 5.2%

J.D. Martinez 5.3%

M. Trout 5.7%

M. Cabrera 6.7%

C. Stewart 7.3%

J. Harrison 7.6%

C. Granderson 8.2%

G. Greiner 8.6%

V. Martinez 8.5%

J. McCann 9.2%

J. Mercer 9.3%



J. Upton 10.4

D. Machado 10.7%

J. Hicks 10.9%

J. Candelario 11.2%

M. Mahtook 11.4%



I. Kinsler 12.2%

L. Martin 12.6%

G. Bechham 12.8%

Y. Cespedes 13.0%

J. Jones 14.1%

P. Kozma 16.1%

J. Iglesias 16.8%

R. Rodriguez 19.0%



MLB Averages

2019 Current = 9.4%

2018 = 10.3%

2017 = 9.6%

2016 = 9.7%

2015 = 9.5%

2014 = 9.6%


A low rate means you are not getting fooled on pitches and/or are able to barrel up the ball.


Percentage of balls in play Opposite Way:

G. Greiner 30.6%

J. Votto 30.4%

P. Kozma 29.8%

C. Stewart 29.5%

M. Cabrera 28.3%

J. Iglesias 28.3%

J. McCann 28.0%

N. Goodrum 27.5%

M. Trout 27.4%

N. Castellanos 27.3%

G. Beckham 26.8%

J.D. Martinez 26.5%

J. Upton 26.3%

J. Hicks 25.6%

J. Candelario 25.0%

J. Harrison 24.8%

J. Mercer 24.0%

V. Martinez 23.7%

L. Martin 23.3%

Y. Cespedes 22.8%

R. Rodriguez 22.5%

M. Mahtook 22.4%

I. Kinsler 21.7%

D. Machado 21.5%

C. Granderson 20.8%

J. Jones 20.2%