Yay the season is over

[jever4321]

Get through the bowl game and move on to team 135.... This season has sucked. That is all.

 

[tigersofjustice]

On to basketball...which I still think will be serious contenders once (if) everyone gets fully healthy.

 

[bamf_16]

HUGE disappointment. I was on Northwestern's campus this past summer and bs'ed with a guy in the book store. I honestly thought the UM/NW game was going to determine who would play OSU in Indianapolis.

On the one hand, I'm fearful that today may have saved jobs for the offensive coaching staff, on the other, I can't imagine a losing conference record, HORRID November, and overall WTF moments not resulting in some level of change.

The 2007 season will long be remembered as the most disappointing UM season simply b/c of the National Championship hopes. But this season isn't far behind.

 

[jever4321]

HUGE disappointment. I was on Northwestern's campus this past summer and bs'ed with a guy in the book store. I honestly thought the UM/NW game was going to determine who would play OSU in Indianapolis.

On the one hand, I'm fearful that today may have saved jobs for the offensive coaching staff, on the other, I can't imagine a losing conference record, HORRID November, and overall WTF moments not resulting in some level of change.

The 2007 season will long be remembered as the most disappointing UM season simply b/c of the National Championship hopes. But this season isn't far behind.

I totally agree... What a Shame this season.

 

[bamf_16]

And it's going to be interesting to see what guys come back and what guys don't. I can understand a coach's devotion to his seniors, but if I'm Green or Smith, watching Fitz get look after look with seemingly no accountability (always out there whether he sucks or not) I'm second guessing my decision. If Fitz had another year of eligibility, I'd have bet on one if not both leaving.

If I'm Taco Charlton, and I leave high school early, work to put on weight, and I have to sit on the bench behind Brennan Fucking Beyer and Keith Motherfucking Heitzman, I'm wondering what the fuck is going on. His offer list wasn't as impressive as some of the other young guys I thought might be playing more though, so his transfer options might not be all that attractive.

We'll see typical attrition, probably from some DBs and maybe even an OL or two. Bellomy?

 

[Michchamp]

And it's going to be interesting to see what guys come back and what guys don't. I can understand a coach's devotion to his seniors, but if I'm Green or Smith, watching Fitz get look after look with seemingly no accountability (always out there whether he sucks or not) I'm second guessing my decision. If Fitz had another year of eligibility, I'd have bet on one if not both leaving.

If I'm Taco Charlton, and I leave high school early, work to put on weight, and I have to sit on the bench behind Brennan Fucking Beyer and Keith Motherfucking Heitzman, I'm wondering what the fuck is going on. His offer list wasn't as impressive as some of the other young guys I thought might be playing more though, so his transfer options might not be all that attractive.

We'll see typical attrition, probably from some DBs and maybe even an OL or two. Bellomy?

I don't know about that.

unless Hoke is a total cock to them in the locker room, I'd guess most of these guys will be back. all signs pointed to his players liking him (with few exceptions) from day one, and I don't think losing 5 games changes that.

they played well today, and I think that shows that these players supported their coaches and vice versa.

 

[jever4321]

I don't know about that.

unless Hoke is a total cock to them in the locker room, I'd guess most of these guys will be back. all signs pointed to his players liking him (with few exceptions) from day one, and I don't think losing 5 games changes that.

they played well today, and I think that shows that these players supported their coaches and vice versa.

I tend to agree with this.

 

[Michchamp]

I tend to agree with this.

well, that's very nice. thank you kindly.

do you want to come with me to Columbus next week to burn things and beat up people in the streets?

I plan to make it look like this:

pretty sure Tinsel is in, but he hasn't responded to my message yet.

 

[jever4321]

well, that's very nice. thank you kindly.

do you want to come with me to Columbus next week to burn things and beat up people in the streets?

I plan to make it look like this:

pretty sure Tinsel is in, but he hasn't responded to my message yet.

I'll meet you there!

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Well, I'm still hopeful we can end on a bright spot with the bowl game and go into next year with a win on our minds. For some reason an 8 win season just seems a lot better than 7. I still think that next season we start to see some major improvements with the young guys. Though, it would have been nice to get the OSU monkey off our back this year. The longer that hangs around the more mental it becomes.

 

[bamf_16]

Well, I'm still hopeful we can end on a bright spot with the bowl game and go into next year with a win on our minds. For some reason an 8 win season just seems a lot better than 7. I still think that next season we start to see some major improvements with the young guys. Though, it would have been nice to get the OSU monkey off our back this year. The longer that hangs around the more mental it becomes.

I hear ya. 8-5 looks so much better to me than does 7-6.

 

[biggunsbob]

Question

Why is Hoke's 3-5 different then Rich Rod's?
Just because he is a Michigan Man?
What worries me is Hoke and his staff did much better with Rich Rod's guys in year one then he is right now getting his guys...

 

[bamf_16]

Question

Why is Hoke's 3-5 different then Rich Rod's?
Just because he is a Michigan Man?
What worries me is Hoke and his staff did much better with Rich Rod's guys in year one then he is right now getting his guys...

That is a very fair question, and honestly, I hope to see some responses to it.

I've asked it a couple times of people in the course of conversation, again stipulating that at the end of the 2010 season, I thought a defensive coaching staff overhaul was best, keep RR with new defensive minds and see what happens. UM wasn't competitive against OSU that year nor in the bowl game which made the decision to do that even tougher.

I think part of the answer to your question might be how Hoke got to 7-5 in year three. I think part of it too is that in his three years here, UM has held its own against OSU. Winning the school's second BCS bowl in its history in year 1 probably bought more time than did a 3-9 season ever will. On the other hand, 3-9 to 5-7 to 7-5 (7-6) seems like a more attractive progression than does 10-2 (11-2), 8-4 (8-5), 7-5 (?-?).

No matter what anybody says, the friction between two factions of the fanbase and the overall negativity surrounding the program was, is, and will always be a factor

Plus, Dave Brandon didn't hire Rich Rodriguez.

The "Michigan Man" thing is huge with a big portion of the fan base. I think it will be better for the program when the majority of those old farts end up in old folks homes or lose their minds to the point they have no idea what's on the TV. They do more harm than good.

I think some people will struggle with this question, simply because for a lot of fans, it's an emotional topic and we sometimes struggle to articulate what we feel. Part of it too is the "eye test."

Yesterday's game may have been enough to save jobs for Borges, Funk, and company. But I hope people remember the OSU game in 2009 where the non-existent UM defense held Pryor & OSU to 21 points in a close loss. Look what keeping that defensive staff did for the following season.

Edit: For me... Brady Hoke has been FAR from perfect, but he's been competitive with OSU, is recruiting multiple highly rated prospects at positions of need, I'm seeing player development that looks promising, and I still hold true to my belief that a new hire deserves at least 4 years.

Does this topic deserve its own thread?

 

[UMRules06]

Question

Why is Hoke's 3-5 different then Rich Rod's?
Just because he is a Michigan Man?
What worries me is Hoke and his staff did much better with Rich Rod's guys in year one then he is right now getting his guys...

If you're just looking at it comparing one season to the other, I don't think it's different at all. Hoke is getting plenty of heat from fans even after the "moral victory" against OSU, so let's not act like he's everyone's favorite right now. Like it or not there are two things that are working in Hoke's favor when you compare him to Rich Rod.

1. The Michigan factor. It's real, and it plays a role. We may not like it as fans, but a large majority of Michigan support comes from old school traditional guys who want to hate on OSU, sing the fight song, run a pro-style offense etc. Bo Schembechler is forever a God to these people, and anyone who emulates him will get at least decent support.

2. He won 11 games and a Sugar bowl. It seems like a distant memory now obviously, but that season definitely bought him an extra year or two that RichRod did not get. Call it unfair because they were RR's players all you want, but RR never even sniffed a BCS game here.

Personally I am not a big Hoke fan anymore, but I do want to see what he does with one more year. I like Green and Smith moving forward as a potentially great runningback tandem, and Funchess and Butt will be huge contributors again next season as well. The defense needs to get better absolutely, so we will have to see about that.

I hate selling a stock so quickly just because it's trending down. RichRod was a little different because I (along with most) did not buy into his scheme or personality ever fitting at the University. Remember Carr got off to a mediocre start as HC and then he won a NC in year 3 I think? I just hate the idea of starting from scratch all over again and recycling these same arguments 3 years from now. Hoke's 4th year is make or break for me.

Borges on the other hand.....he can go

 

[jever4321]

I remember cringing when richrod would compare the UM-OSU rivalry to Pitt WVU. That didn't do him any favors.

 

[bamf_16]

I remember cringing when richrod would compare the UM-OSU rivalry to Pitt WVU. That didn't do him any favors.

Hey! Watch it!

In Pittsburgh some years, that game would almost be a sellout!



And in response to UMRules, you're right on with that analysis.

 

[rumseyhouse77]

There were a lot of things swirling around RR, that combined with the failures on the field led to his firing. He never got the rivalry with ohio*, he insulted the fanbase dismissing it with comments like "get a life". The fanbase was booing him (remember when DR was given the award as Big 10 offensive player of the year), and attendance was slipping. His behavior at the player banquet where he sang "You raise me up" and cried. All of these things together led RR's firing. But also, the year 1 11-2 record for Hoke goes a long way and Hoke has yet to have a losing season. RR didn't have a winning season until year 3 and even then the lack of offense and special teams in the bowl was embarrassing to the program. If you remember, Michigan couldn't kick a fg in the Gator Bowl and the kickoffs were going out of bounds giving the Mississippi State short fields. There was little if any positive feeling about the program. RR and his system weren't working and he had to go. As far as Hoke goes, while the team struggled this season, I don't think the problems are systemic as they were under RR. This season seriously hurt Hoke, no question about that and if things don't improve next season, then he will likely have to go too, Michigan Man or not.

 

[Gulo Blue]

It's not the same year 3. Lot of close games this year. RR's 3rd year saw 4 close wins, but no close losses. That season easily could have been much worse, but it couldn't have easily been much better. This year, 4 out of 5 losses were within a score (and 3 wins could have gone the other way.) The W/L column looks the same, but this team had a better year than 2010.

It's a little interesting looking at best case and worst case if you allow close games to have gone the other way.

http://mgoblog.com/diaries/just-one-play

 

[Michlady]

Thus team I think had a bit mire younger players in year three

 

[hungry]

I don't know about that.

unless Hoke is a total cock to them in the locker room, I'd guess most of these guys will be back. all signs pointed to his players liking him (with few exceptions) from day one, and I don't think losing 5 games changes that.

they played well today, and I think that shows that these players supported their coaches and vice versa.

Who is "they?"