Lojack signs with Vikes

[boogerlovejoy]

Its called more experience. Plus, Houston isn't any better than he was with Atlanta. Scheffler isn't any better either, he had solid years in Denver. Sims to, with his former team. We all knew we were getting a good player.

Houston was TERRIBLE in Atlanta.

Awful.

You don't even follow football, do you?

 

[Mitchrapp]

Houston was TERRIBLE in Atlanta.

Awful.

You don't even follow football, do you?

No he wasn't. The only thing they would say is he couldn't turn around to the ball. Houston is a decent CB but probably looks better because our number 2 is Bentley, Green or Greenwood.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

No he wasn't. The only thing they would say is he couldn't turn around to the ball. Houston is a decent CB but probably looks better because our number 2 is Bentley, Green or Greenwood.

You're right. When they signed Robinson they kepts Brian Williams and Chris Owens over keeping Houston.....which they traded for a 6th round pick.

I'm sure he was highly thought of.

 

[lionsFTW]

If the Lions go 6-10, then yes, heads should roll 100%. But you're not going to blame Ansah, are you? Five or fifteen sacks shouldnt determine their record....not entirely anyways

I never said I would blame Ansah, but I would blame the pick of Ansah.

I'm saying taking Milliner/Warmack/Cooper at 5 and whatever DE is there at 36 puts a better team on the field next year than does taking Ansah at 5 and any player left in the entire draft!

If the lions go 6-10 next year, like you stated above, heads should roll. So why are they drafting like they don't have to put the best team possible on the field next year? Like they have 2-3 more years to let Ansah become what his potential says he can?

The people saying we got the best value are flat out wrong, imo. You can't look at every pick in a vacuum like that. If that's the case then we should've taken Star Lotulelei, Tavon Austin or Warmack because they were pretty clearly the best football players available. You don't do that, though, because there has to be a value + need balance. Otherwise you end up with 16 stud defensive tackles, lol.

We're not in the rebuilding stage where we have holes everywhere and can go BPA, we're in the win now stage and that's where my gripe comes from. They did a piss poor job of formulating a gameplan and projecting who was gonna be there atop round 2. The game plan from the very start should have always been to take the best DE possible at the top of 2 because no matter how round 1 fell there was going to be a good value + need DE available. It was easily the smartest/safest/most optimal game plan. Now we're either gonna have to take someone who doesn't fill a direct hole to maintain value, or give up value and reach to fill a position of need. Awesome!

 

[Mitchrapp]

They might think we're in a win now stage, maybe even some of the people on this board think that. But this was a 4 win team that was probably better than what they showed but not quite a 10 win team they had in 2011. IMO, they're more of a rebuild team than a win now team..

 

[LKP]

They might think we're in a win now stage, maybe even some of the people on this board think that. But this was a 4 win team that was probably better than what they showed but not quite a 10 win team they had in 2011. IMO, they're more of a rebuild team than a win now team..

What do we have to rebuild? DE, LT check and check with Ansah and Reiff. QB set, RB set, WR need speed only, TE check. RT and RG you can get away with lesser players. Hilliard/Fox/Nagy could surpise too. Still have 7 picks as well. Raiola can hold it down one more year and Sims is set at LG.

LE with Jones/Young, one OLB, maybe number 2 CB maybe not with 3 guys and Bartell, you can get away with lesser players. Both DTs, young top 5 DE, MLB, CB1 and both safties are set right now. And Levy got a 3 year deal with young development behind him.

I wouldn't call speed WR, possible RG,RT,CB2, one OLB a rebuild. Especially with 7 picks left in the next 2 days.

 

[mhughes0021]

What do we have to rebuild? DE, LT check and check with Ansah and Reiff. QB set, RB set, WR need speed only, TE check. RT and RG you can get away with lesser players. Hilliard/Fox/Nagy could surpise too. Still have 7 picks as well. Raiola can hold it down one more year and Sims is set at LG.

LE with Jones/Young, one OLB, maybe number 2 CB maybe not with 3 guys and Bartell, you can get away with lesser players. Both DTs, young top 5 DE, MLB, CB1 and both safties are set right now. And Levy got a 3 year deal with young development behind him.

I wouldn't call speed WR, possible RG,RT,CB2, one OLB a rebuild. Especially with 7 picks left in the next 2 days.

oline is in shambles. Dline had more pieces last year and sucked....not to mention Suhs cap number is 22 mil next year. On the 3rd day god made the detroit lions shitty secondary.....and it hasnt got any better since the dawn of time.....hopefully the Quin signing helps. LBs are awful other than tulloch.

 

[LKP]

oline is in shambles. Dline had more pieces last year and sucked....not to mention Suhs cap number is 22 mil next year. On the 3rd day god made the detroit lions shitty secondary.....and it hasnt got any better since the dawn of time.....hopefully the Quin signing helps. LBs are awful other than tulloch.

Shambles with Reiff, Sims, Raiola, Hilliard/Fox and Nagy plus maybe some draft picks. I don't think so.

Lions can handle Suh's number. They will be under with Suh and Stafford on giant numbers. Then Stafford will be extended. Calvin is still low next year and they get a ton of dead money off the books. Don't worry about the cap. They got it.

Tulloch and Levy can get the job done.

Houston,Delmas,Quinn and some young talent is the makings of a good secondary. Top 5 like first 10 in 2011 when Houston/Delmas were healthy with the superstars of Berry, Wright and Spievey at the other positions.

NOT EVEN CLOSE TO A REBUILD. Fill the lesser positions nows. RT, RG, OLB, CB2 are much better than you think.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Running between the tackles will never happen if Crapola is still here..Secondary, as painful it is to say, sucks. Adding a S will only help so much. We need a G, and a OT. At least one starting DE and the LB's, not good. Didn't even get into WR or RB for the future.

We're not in a complete built but we're certainly not in a win now phase. Not with salary cap hell..

 

[LKP]

Running between the tackles will never happen if Crapola is still here..Secondary, as painful it is to say, sucks. Adding a S will only help so much. We need a G, and a OT. At least one starting DE and the LB's, not good. Didn't even get into WR or RB for the future.

We're not in a complete built but we're certainly not in a win now phase. Not with salary cap hell..

They are not in cap hell. Stafford extension saves money and they were able to get everyone they wanted this year.

5 year 25 million and you can have a 2.5 million cap number. See Houston and Quin

 

[tonyballs]

I never said I would blame Ansah, but I would blame the pick of Ansah.

I'm saying taking Milliner/Warmack/Cooper at 5 and whatever DE is there at 36 puts a better team on the field next year than does taking Ansah at 5 and any player left in the entire draft!

If the lions go 6-10 next year, like you stated above, heads should roll. So why are they drafting like they don't have to put the best team possible on the field next year? Like they have 2-3 more years to let Ansah become what his potential says he can?

The people saying we got the best value are flat out wrong, imo. You can't look at every pick in a vacuum like that. If that's the case then we should've taken Star Lotulelei, Tavon Austin or Warmack because they were pretty clearly the best football players available. You don't do that, though, because there has to be a value + need balance. Otherwise you end up with 16 stud defensive tackles, lol.

We're not in the rebuilding stage where we have holes everywhere and can go BPA, we're in the win now stage and that's where my gripe comes from. They did a piss poor job of formulating a gameplan and projecting who was gonna be there atop round 2. The game plan from the very start should have always been to take the best DE possible at the top of 2 because no matter how round 1 fell there was going to be a good value + need DE available. It was easily the smartest/safest/most optimal game plan. Now we're either gonna have to take someone who doesn't fill a direct hole to maintain value, or give up value and reach to fill a position of need. Awesome!

Who said anything about rebuilding? Ansah was arguably the 'best' DE in the draft. He plays the run, has the ability to get to the QB and is a freakish athlete for his size..he's huge, he moves around like a kid at 230 lbs and he's 275.

They acquired THREE starters in the first 3 rounds!! Ansah will immediately start, Slay will start opposite of Houston (at worst...nickel) and Worford is a nasty Guard who will immediately replace that bum Peterman. Boom!! Then the rest were holes they filled for depth and ST's. What's the deal, bro??

They did a great job. Piss poor job my ass...

And don't get it twisted when people say the 'potential' is there for Ansah. Yeah, it's there but he's going to be thrown into the fire immediately. People just mean that this kid has a ceiling that is sky high. He'll get better every year he's a Lion.

 

[cheeno]

I agree Tony, most of this analysis is based off Ansah hate. If they had of taken Milliner who has had more surgeries than Robocop and is currently on pace to miss camp, and then Moore, Hunt or Okafor in the second all the Mini Mayocks on here would have given the draft an A for value when all were at best 4th round D ends (Cincy reached). (Also if you bag on MMs injury picks you can't be knocking him or Xanders *yeah baby* for passing on Milliner, same goes for old one knee Tank Carradine).

Okafor, Hunt and Datone Jones to pick out three names on people's list, all played in the senior bowl and didn't do sweet fuck all (Hunt was particularly brutal) in the wide 9 the guy we took, took over the game. It was literally the Ansah bowl. Watch the whole game to make yourself feel better, if you dislike the guy.

Add on top of that taking a guard in a offense like ours in the top ten would have been absolutely retarded as well. Not only has one not been taken top ten in 60 years but in case we haven't realized yet were not the 2002 Pittsburg Steelers handing it off to Jerome Bettis. And suprise the guy who was the offensive coordinator for that team was the first to draft a guard as he's now the HC of the Cards. The other team to draft a guard? There whole team is built around running the ball successfully with Chris Johnson. We nabbed Warford in the third who was all SEC and gave up 0 sacks last year and was Sharrif Floyd's worst nightmare. Talk about value.

In the end we needed a D end, we got the best 4-3 one in the draft by almost a full round.

 

[inkfreq]

This is the draft when we find out if Suh is a leader. Period.

If Suh picked up any of that natural leadership skill from KVB, he can turn Ansah into the next Julius Peppers and Devin Taylor into the hidden gem of this draft. Both of them have had the physical tools and skills to be great first round picks.

If he's not a leader, Devin Taylor could pick up the ugly habits we've seen at times, the lack of discipline. Ansah could decline.

Suh has to step up and set the tempo early for these guys. He has to set the example of getting a hand on a runner every practice, chasing guys down field, and lead with the killer attitude we have seen from him.

I don't want to see "nice guy" Suh. I want to see the guy that tried to rip Jake Delhomme's head off. Breed that killer instinct. Mold your new teammates into a nasty dominate force.

If he can do that, we will see one of the nastiest D-Lines ever assembled next year, and Jason Jones may find himself as a rotational DT, which is fine too. If he can't do that, this line may melt rather quickly.

Time for my man to stop tweeting his "Suh Squad" and start being the captain of that defense. Tulloch too. Houston too. Those guys have to captain their unit.

 

[lionsFTW]

There's zero legitimacy to the argument that Ansah, Slay, Warford puts a better team on the field next year than Milliner, Carradine/Hunt, Warford.

Anything else is an appeal to emotion on the make you feel fuzzy story/attitude of Ziggy and his "potential". The guy has 9 fucking starts in his entire career! I had more football experience than him by the time I left middle school, so acting like drafting him isn't a major, major gamble in an of itself is completely ridiculous.

I usually like your post, Tony, but you're not quite comprehending what I'm saying here as you're argument is just circular logic that really goes nowhere.

DE in the 2nd should have been the game plan all along as it was the most optimal strategy to have the best draft possible (make an argument for why this isn't true).

The best value at the top of the second in terms of value + need was going to be 100% DE no matter how round 1 fell (argument against please).

Instead we take the DE at 5 (who's nowhere close to a sure thing) and give away value in the 2nd because we have to reach on Slay to fill a need because we knew the run on CB's was happening in the 2nd and we couldn't wait till 3 for a CB. It was such a position of need we simply couldn't wait to address it (is this wrong?).

Like him or not, Slay was nowhere in the vicinity of the best player available at that point. Most grades show him as around the 5-8 best CB in the draft and 60th to 80th best player overall. We took him at 36 because the position absolutely had to be filled. This is the definition of giving away value, is it not?

Bottom line, we gave away value in the 2nd in the hopes that Ziggy realizes his potential in 2-3 years. A major gamble that this front office may not even be around to realize. It really is that simple.

 

[manchild98]

I don't know why people get so upset or excited after a draft. None of us have a clue if a guy will be good in the NFL or not. As for Ansah only have 9 starts in college, how many college games did Antonio Gates play in and he turned out to be a damn good TE. Come in from off the ledge and let it play itself out.

And really this is why fans should not get so deep in the draft. People listen to everyone else's grades but have no access to the actual team's board. So they all think they know exactly where a guy should be drafted because of guys like Kiper, McShay, etc. Then when he's not or he's skipped over for someone else they freak out. We could have gotten him later, etc. You don't know that at all.

 

[lionsFTW]

In the end we needed a D end, we got the best 4-3 one in the draft by almost a full round.

In the end we needed a DE and a CB

#1 CB and #2DE >>>>>>> #1 DE and #6 CB

 

[tonyballs]

There's zero legitimacy to the argument that Ansah, Slay, Warford puts a better team on the field next year than Milliner, Carradine/Hunt, Warford.

Anything else is an appeal to emotion on the make you feel fuzzy story/attitude of Ziggy and his "potential". The guy has 9 fucking starts in his entire career! I had more football experience than him by the time I left middle school, so acting like drafting him isn't a major, major gamble in an of itself is completely ridiculous.

I usually like your post, Tony, but you're not quite comprehending what I'm saying here as you're argument is just circular logic that really goes nowhere.

DE in the 2nd should have been the game plan all along as it was the most optimal strategy to have the best draft possible (make an argument for why this isn't true).

The best value at the top of the second in terms of value + need was going to be 100% DE no matter how round 1 fell (argument against please).

Instead we take the DE at 5 (who's nowhere close to a sure thing) and give away value in the 2nd because we have to reach on Slay to fill a need because we knew the run on CB's was happening in the 2nd and we couldn't wait till 3 for a CB. It was such a position of need we simply couldn't wait to address it (is this wrong?).

Like him or not, Slay was nowhere in the vicinity of the best player available at that point. Most grades show him as around the 5-8 best CB in the draft and 60th to 80th best player overall. We took him at 36 because the position absolutely had to be filled. This is the definition of giving away value, is it not?

Bottom line, we gave away value in the 2nd in the hopes that Ziggy realizes his potential in 2-3 years. A major gamble that this front office may not even be around to realize. It really is that simple.

Simple to you maybe. You actually think they drafted Ansah and are 'hoping' he pans out?? Cmon man. They obviously LOVE the kid and did their homework on him. He is a freak of nature and will immediately make an impact. besides, they worked with Ansah at the senior bowl and he flourished in that wide 9 defense. Yeah, it was one game but they had a week and then some to talk to these DE's and see who fits their system. Ansah killed it....end of story. They NEEDED a DE and he was it. Go look at his sports science video if it makes you feel better......it's absurd.

They stayed away from Milliner because he's a bandaid. I liked Miliner but he's more than likely to get hurt. We got a solid starter in Slay in round 2....no damage done.

And then picked up a stud guard in Warford in the 3rd.

Winning.

 

[lionsFTW]

Come in from off the ledge and let it play itself out.

I apologize if it comes of as me being emotional about this because it's the farthest thing from the truth. I'm as analytical a person as you'll prolly ever meet. None of these picks make me mad or sad or anything. I may get frustrated during discussions with people not following the argument sometimes and bringing up factors that have nothing to do with the equation. In the end I'm just making the logical argument that DE should have been the 2nd round pick 100% of the time to have the best rounds 1 and 2 possible. Imo, to this point nobody has made a sufficient argument against this.

 

[cheeno]

There's zero legitimacy to the argument that Ansah, Slay, Warford puts a better team on the field next year than Milliner, Carradine/Hunt, Warford.

Anything else is an appeal to emotion on the make you feel fuzzy story/attitude of Ziggy and his "potential". The guy has 9 fucking starts in his entire career! I had more football experience than him by the time I left middle school, so acting like drafting him isn't a major, major gamble in an of itself is completely ridiculous.

I usually like your post, Tony, but you're not quite comprehending what I'm saying here as you're argument is just circular logic that really goes nowhere.

DE in the 2nd should have been the game plan all along as it was the most optimal strategy to have the best draft possible (make an argument for why this isn't true).

The best value at the top of the second in terms of value + need was going to be 100% DE no matter how round 1 fell (argument against please).

Instead we take the DE at 5 (who's nowhere close to a sure thing) and give away value in the 2nd because we have to reach on Slay to fill a need because we knew the run on CB's was happening in the 2nd and we couldn't wait till 3 for a CB. It was such a position of need we simply couldn't wait to address it (is this wrong?).

Like him or not, Slay was nowhere in the vicinity of the best player available at that point. Most grades show him as around the 5-8 best CB in the draft and 60th to 80th best player overall. We took him at 36 because the position absolutely had to be filled. This is the definition of giving away value, is it not?

Bottom line, we gave away value in the 2nd in the hopes that Ziggy realizes his potential in 2-3 years. A major gamble that this front office may not even be around to realize. It really is that simple.

Logic? You wanted a run blocking guard at 5. Go and do a few Sudokus buddy.

 

[lionsFTW]

And then picked up a stud guard in Warford in the 3rd.

IMO Warford was the best pick they made in the entire draft! My gripe really has nothing to do with what happened after rounds 1 and 2, though. It's simply what was the best path to take to have the best first two rounds possible. We didn't do that imo.