Jesus Christ, Sparty

[Spartan23MSU]

More threads dedicated to MSU. Not surprising. When was the last one on the MSU board dedicated to UM, maybe a year ago? Enjoy the 6th straight loss in a row at the geriatric center. *yawns*

 

[hungry]

More threads dedicated to MSU. Not surprising. When was the last one on the MSU board dedicated to UM, maybe a year ago? Enjoy the 6th straight loss in a row at the geriatric center. *yawns*

I wouldn't know. I never go there. Why would I?

 

[dubbsco]

Half the threads on RCMB are Michigan-focused. Spare me that crap.

 

[thewolverines24]

Ha, ha...I didn't even know yesterday was national signing day!

The various "experts..." - Rivals, CBS Sports, Sporting News, ESPN and so forth...are all over the board on their rankings of the teams' recruiting classes...except they all have Alabama #1, I guess...after that, all over the place...

Really tough to have the #1 class every year when you give a new car to the majority of your recruits.

 

[Gulo Blue]

I actually almost posted with it that the only poster who probably pays less attention to recruiting is you.

You've got me this time.

I was aware we wanted Solomon, but didn't have the commitment, I knew we were top 5, but still behind OSU, and the day of, I looked up enough stuff to be on the lookout for word about Collins. We kicked butt landing wide receivers, but could use more O-line.

 

[wlvrnstlr4life]

Maybe I dont feel so bad anymore. Lot of sour feelings from the faithful. I figured some of the Spartan fans would be a little pissed off about the recruiting efforts of their coach and would chime in differently. But, no.

So, did anyone hear of MD honoring this guys commitment or what? Is he still in jail and does the jail have a fax?

 

[gotime909]

Maybe I dont feel so bad anymore. Lot of sour feelings from the faithful. I figured some of the Spartan fans would be a little pissed off about the recruiting efforts of their coach and would chime in differently. But, no.

So, did anyone hear of MD honoring this guys commitment or what? Is he still in jail and does the jail have a fax?

Maybe we're not all freaking out because this is the type of class we've been seeing for 11 years now and it seems to have worked pretty well. We missed out on a handful of priority guys which is always frustrating, but Dantonio has done well with his backup plans in the past.

Since Dantonio took over we've averaged the 31st ranked class and only finished with a top 20 class ONCE(last year 17th). In that span Michigan has finished with an average rank of 13th and that includes coaching change years of Hoke's 26th ranked first year and Harb's 37th ranked first class. So in that 11 years MSU has had one top 20 class and UM has only finished outside the top 20 twice.

 

[dubbsco]

Lots of smoke and mirrors. Without a QB that can constantly put the team on his back (Cousins, Cook), you see the results.

 

[gotime909]

Lots of smoke and mirrors. Without a QB that can constantly put the team on his back (Cousins, Cook), you see the results.

Yeah, those 2 played great in the upset win in Columbus 2 years ago.

 

[MSUMatt28]

Lots of smoke and mirrors. Without a QB that can constantly put the team on his back (Cousins, Cook), you see the results.

I don't recall Cousins and Cook doing much to help the team rank in the Top 10 defensively several years.

 

[dubbsco]

Cook did SO much for that team. He bailed you guys out a TON.

And it's not a bad thing, not my point. I'm just saying that the whole maintaining success over an extended period of time with average recruiting classes is not a feasible way to win. If it turns into another bad season in 2017, it may start to mirror what Beilein did in 2012-2014.

 

[deathroh]

Just looking at 247, Wisconsin hasn't had a top 30 class since.... 2001

 

[deathroh]

They've had 10+ wins in half of their seasons over that stretch

 

[MSUMatt28]

Cook did SO much for that team. He bailed you guys out a TON.

And it's not a bad thing, not my point. I'm just saying that the whole maintaining success over an extended period of time with average recruiting classes is not a feasible way to win. If it turns into another bad season in 2017, it may start to mirror what Beilein did in 2012-2014.

His final 2 years perhaps. During his sophomore year he was mostly a game manager for the Big Ten/Rose Bowl champions, though he did develop into a guy who was making plays later in the season. That team was carried mostly by it's defense. And his senior year for the playoff team he was rendered mostly useless the final month due to the shoulder injury. O'Connor took a lot of blame this year and he certainly wasn't good, but I think the collapse of the defense was at much to blame for 3-9 as anything. Get the defense back to a good level and the team at least is back in a bowl game, and then we'll see about what they can do with the QB spot. So we'll see on that. Losing Narduzzi and not adequately replacing him might end up being the real issue.

Having consistently highly rated recruiting classes certainly gives you more of a margin for error and protect more against year-to-year dips (the "reloading" years). But it guarantees nothing. You still need the coaching and development program. Notre Dame and several others usually rank pretty high in recruiting and rarely does much with it. Other schools get by with recruiting classes in the 20s because they can find the diamonds in the rough and/or develop the others. I would much rather have Top 10 classes every year than not, but that's the way it goes.

Alabama has both factors in place and they win 4 national titles in a decade and are in the top 4 every year. But nobody is Alabama.

 

[gotime909]

Cook did SO much for that team. He bailed you guys out a TON.

And it's not a bad thing, not my point. I'm just saying that the whole maintaining success over an extended period of time with average recruiting classes is not a feasible way to win. If it turns into another bad season in 2017, it may start to mirror what Beilein did in 2012-2014.

The D line was a MUCH bigger problem this year than losing Cook. Aside from losing Calhoun, Heath and Thomas to the NFL, we lost Evans, Sweat, Enoch and Peat as transfers and Knox chose to not use his 6th year and enter a career in law enforcement. That's 8 guys on the d line. Leaving McDowell, Cooper, 2 flop grad transfers and a bunch of freshmen to man the trenches. By the end of the year those young kids were playing pretty damn good so I feel good about that area going forward.

 

[dubbsco]

But that builds into my point. If you lose those guys and don't recruit better talent, there is no depth to reduce the impact. Trying to continue to do the finding diamonds in the rough strategy just cannot maintain over an extended period of time. He's done a remarkable job of identifying guys no one else wants, I'm not arguing that. But in order to get to that elite of elite peaks, you need to be pulling in top 5-10 classes on a consistent basis. Finishing 25-30 consistently is going to make things that much more difficult.

And I know sports radio is shit on all the time, but this EXACT same comparison was brought up about 10 minutes ago with Beilein. He's continued to try this finding sleeper players and it has completely bombed out.

 

[gotime909]

But that builds into my point. If you lose those guys and don't recruit better talent, there is no depth to reduce the impact. Trying to continue to do the finding diamonds in the rough strategy just cannot maintain over an extended period of time. He's done a remarkable job of identifying guys no one else wants, I'm not arguing that. But in order to get to that elite of elite peaks, you need to be pulling in top 5-10 classes on a consistent basis. Finishing 25-30 consistently is going to make things that much more difficult.

And I know sports radio is shit on all the time, but this EXACT same comparison was brought up about 10 minutes ago with Beilein. He's continued to try this finding sleeper players and it has completely bombed out.

I don't get the Beilein comparison that you keep making????? What "diamonds in the rough" has he found???? He's just had one good team(2 year run) in his 10 years at Michigan and that was with top recruits. Dantonio has proven for 10 years that he can build winning teams with his players.

 

[wlvrnstlr4life]

Alabama has both factors in place and they win 4 national titles in a decade and are in the top 4 every year. But nobody is Alabama.

Alabama has carz! They are a pathetic program that will never get caught because of friends in high places looking the other way. Dantonio and Harbaugh are every bit as good or better than Saban. Boosters helped Saban in 2007 when his program was in dire straits his 1st season. You promise every recruit they will play year one and then you give them a cash incentive/car. This is how you end up with the number 1 recruiting class after a 7-6 season(6-6 previous season) and a loss to Louisiana-Monroe in Tuscaloosa. Saban had no luster after that season, especially the way he left the Dolphins and LSU.

Its funny how many people forget where that program was. Saban simply showing up on Campus did not magically make them better. $$$$$$$$

 

[deathroh]

I don't get the Beilein comparison that you keep making????? What "diamonds in the rough" has he found???? He's just had one good team(2 year run) in his 10 years at Michigan and that was with top recruits. Dantonio has proven for 10 years that he can build winning teams with his players.

Nah, you're way off base with your comment on the two year run (they actually had a nice 3-year run). McGary & Robinson were the only top recruits, and Robinson was hovering around 100 when he committed. I don't believe there was anybody else on the roster in the top 75 of their class.

It's hard to say what exactly constitute the "rough", especially if you're comparing fball and bball recruits, but if you look at the success of a player relative to their recruiting ranking Beilein has plenty of examples.

Novak & Douglass - Didn't crack the top 200. Sure they weren't great, but they (especially Novak) ended up solid Big Ten contributors.

Tim Hardaway - Ended up outside the top-100 on most sites, but was even lower before Beilein offered him, and it was pretty late in the process. Now balling (every now and then) in the NBA

Trey Burke - 80-100 range, turned into the Big Ten POY and top 10 NBA pick in two years.

Nik Stauskas - Also 80-100 range, also Big Ten POY and top 10 NBA pick.

Caris Levert - 200+ range, would have had a great shot at POY if not for injuries, started first game in the NBA yesterday.

Spike Albrecht - Had only one other D1 offer, turned into a solid Big Ten starter.

DJ Wilson & Mo Wagner - Still a little early to claim they've turned into diamonds, but they were both in the 100-120 range and have been showing great promise this year.


So obviously the well has run dry lately, but it is true that Beilein has gotten a ton out of mediocre recruits.

 

[hungry]

Now there is a new rumor coming out of EL and I don't think you can make this stuff up. Apparently, a black player slept with the girlfriend of MSU star linebacker Reschke. Reschke found out and texted his girlfriend some racial slurs. His "girlfriend" at this point, decides its a good idea to post these messages on social media. Word is that Reschke has been removed from the team.

Perhaps our Spartan patrol can confirm or deny this stuff...

It's officially the offseason, so maybe conversations like this one will keep things lively around here.