Greinke breaks collarbone in quentin mound charge

[kalinecountry]

Quentin went to Stanford which is a university for super intelligent people.
But he thinks and reacts like he has rocks in his head.
Like some previously said, he stands on top of the plate and doesn't expect a pitcher to tie him up inside?? Plus he turned into the pitch hitting him on the left side.
Same with yousuckilis, you crowd the plate expect to get pitched inside portion of the plate and expect to get hit a fair amount of times. Why else would he have been hit by greinke previously.
Cal Ripken Jr. and Billy were talking about it on XM radio and the only thing that greinke might have said to set the guy off were the 2 magic words FU. They think he will get about a 5 game suspension. iirc they play each other again within a week; expect the umps to give warnings before first pitch/first game to managers pitchers.

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/20...-carlos-quentin-dodgers-padres-fight-analysis
Greinke vs. Quentin: The Cost of a Brawl.
from beyondtheboxscore

Dylan Hernandez of the L.A. Times reports that after the brawl, Matt Kemp confronted Carlos Quentin and the two exchanged "angry words" with each other; it's entirely possible that this unnecessary confrontation could lead to more fines or suspensions.

Point by point: In a 2-1 game in the 6th inning, who in the world wants to put runners on base? Is there any sense in hitting a guy in this situation? Going back to the article by Dylan Hernandez, Matt Kemp certainly doesn't think so:

People with good baseball IQs know if you have a one-run lead and it's a 3-2 count, Greinke is not going to hit you on purpose,' Kemp said.

Carlos Quentin gets hit by a lot of pitches (115 in his career, according to baseball-reference.com). As Jon Heyman of CBSsports.com points out:

Quentin has been hit more than 100 times by pitches in his history. He should understand that's not because he's A) unlucky, or B) disliked. That's because he stands on the plate and doesn't give ground. It's part of his considerable game.

Before we all jump to conclusions on how long Zack Greinke will be out, recent history of these injuries gives us a range of 1-3 months.

At this point, it's looking like a safe bet on a timetable is going to be 1-3 months (however, we can't be sure until the Dodgers give us one). For now, let's do three different scenarios: a full month, two full months, and three full months. 32 starts per year averages out to just under 1/5th of all of the available games to start, and it is just over 5 starts per month.

Over one month, we'll give Greinke 5 starts. Over two, we'll give him 10. Over three, we'll give him 16. If Zack Greinke misses one month, the Dodgers will lose 0.6875 fWAR in value. If Greinke misses two months, the Dodgers lose 1.375 fWAR. If Greinke were to be slow to recover and miss three full months, the Dodgers would be out 2.2 fWAR.

 

[turok]

Tigers had once acquired an OFer through a trade with the angels, by the name of AL Cowens in '80 who (quite understandably) had held a grudge (like apparently quentin has vs greinke), against a certain white sox RP named ed farmer who had beaned him with a pitch when he was still a kc royal.

IIRC, the game was televised and one of the Tigers' broadcasters back then (Kell and Ostermann I think) when Cowens came up to bat vs farmer for the first time since the beaning, mentioned it b/c of the severity of Cowens injury.

From Cowens' wiki entry:

"A notable feud started between Cowens and Chicago White Sox reliever Ed Farmer early in the 1979 season. On May 8 while playing at Chicago, a Farmer pitch thrown in the top of the 5th inning fractured Cowens' jaw and broke several teeth, Cowens would miss 21 games. Farmer also hit fellow Royal Frank White in the same game and broke his wrist, and caused him to miss 33 contests. "

"The next season on June 20? 1980 while playing Detroit? the now-Tiger Cowens hit an infield grounder against Farmer at Comiskey Park. While Farmer watched his infielder make the play, Cowens ran to mound and tackled the pitcher from behind, instead of running to first base; getting in several punches before the benches cleared and the two were separated. Cowens was suspended for 7 games and a warrant was issued for his arrest in Illinois? forcing him to skip the remainder of the series."

"Later Farmer agreed to drop the charges in exchange for a handshake? and the 2 players brought out the lineup cards before the game on September 1. However, future appearances for Cowens in Chicago were greeted with a "Coward Cowens" banner."

Interesting that Cowens had a warrant issued for his arrest by farmer, perhaps it was b/c Cowens attacked farmer unprovoked? Otherwise why couldn't greinke and other MLB pitchers have done likewise when a batter who had been HBP charged the mound and attacked them? Doubt if farmer was as injured (if he was even hurt at all) like greinke was.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Cowens

 

[kalinecountry]

The two guys on the mid-day MLB XM mentioned the ed farmer and Al Cowens feud and cause and also frank white's hbp and broken wrist.
They also said farmer drilled Trammell in a retaliation and he didn't want to because they were friends?

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/should-mlb-tie-suspensions-to-injury-length/
Should MLB tie suspensions to injury length?
fangraphs

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/carlos-quentins-hbp-zone/
carlos Quentin's hbp zone.
fangraphs

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/58194/greinke-vs-quentin-the-official-breakdown
Greinke vs. Quentin: The Official Breakdown.
from Grantland

 

[turok]

They also said farmer drilled Trammell in a retaliation and he didn't want to because they were friends?

So fucking farmer couldn't have drilled another Tigers batter instead of his "pal" Alan, or was it really b/c of a game situation where he could do it to his advantage, instead of perhaps risking Tram getting an RBI basehit or homer? HP ump should have tossed him immediately, IMO. (if he didn't)

farmer must have hit Trammell in a later game in the 4 game series, b/c farmer came into the game in relief in the top of the 11th, when Cowens led off with a groundout, and after the ensuing fight, he pitched to only 3 more Tigers batters, being Parrish, Wockenfuss and Hebner, giving up a BB, an RBI double,(the winning hit) and an IBB before being lifted for another RP in Trout.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CHA/CHA198006200.shtml

 

[kalinecountry]

They weren't clear on the Trammell hbp from farmer, whether it was that series, before, or later.
sounds like a doosh, and iirc he is a whitesox broadcaster?

 

[turok]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/carlos-quentins-hbp-zone/
carlos Quentin's hbp zone.
fangraphs

Quentin?s rate of being hit by pitches within six inches of the inside corner is 20 times higher than the Major League average. It is, at the minimum, a little hard to have sympathy for the guy.

Sympathy?

quentin is a potential loose cannon, IF he is going to become more likely to charge the mound after what happpened last night. All of the bad publicity. probable suspension, and greinke's injury should give him at least SOME pause the next time he gets HBP, but who knows? Hell, if I was pitching to him and he was snugly overcrowding the plate, with his head and forearms hanging over it, then I would be tempted to aim one right @ his helmet.

Shit, MLB HQ should take a gander @ that link & stat, and suspend quentin's ass for at least a month.

 

[turok]

They weren't clear on the Trammell hbp from farmer, whether it was that series, before, or later.
sounds like a doosh, and iirc he is a whitesox broadcaster?

Well...out of just plain curiosity, I searched the rest of the Tigers games that they played that season vs the white sox, and the very next time that farmer pitched in relief for them vs the Tigers was on August 27, 1980, in the 9th, 10th and 11th innings, and not only did farmer not hit Trammell with a pitch, he walked him, and farmer also did not hit any of the 16 other Tigers batters (some twice, but not Alan, who would have been the 18th batter that he faced) in any of the 3 full IP.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CHA/CHA198008270.shtml

Seems VERY unlikely that farmer would wait for a later game to "exact" his revenge on the Tigers for getting punched a few times by one of their players, who wasn't even a player for the ballclub when the HBP originally occurred.

 

[kalinecountry]

Well...out of just plain curiosity, I searched the rest of the Tigers games that they played that season vs the white sox, and the very next time that farmer pitched in relief for them vs the Tigers was on August 27, 1980, in the 9th, 10th and 11th innings, and not only did farmer not hit Trammell with a pitch, he walked him, and farmer also did not hit any of the 16 other Tigers batters (some twice, but not Alan, who would have been the 18th batter that he faced) in any of the 3 full IP.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CHA/CHA198008270.shtml

Seems VERY unlikely that farmer would wait for a later game to "exact" his revenge on the Tigers for getting punched a few times by one of their players, who wasn't even a player for the ballclub when the HBP originally occurred.

Sorry you wasted time looking for that. it was kinda vague in when that happened with Tram.

 

[turok]

List of pitchers who have hit quentin, from high to low. (greinke has now hit him 3x) Our ace Justin had hit carlos as much as zach had, prior to last night's game. Obviously we Tigers fans don't want to ever see an otherwise perennially healthy Verlander going on the DL b/c being injured by a scrub hot-headed douchebag thug llke quentin charging the mound. So I can sympathize with dodgers fans who have lost who is likely their #2 SP below kershaw for at least a few months.

 

[kalinecountry]

Quentin 2800 plate appearances and 116 hbp.

this just came out;
Zack Greinke to have surgery tomorrow to place rod in collarbone. Rough estimate on time out is eight weeks.

 

[Mitchrapp]

8 weeks sucks..

 

[kalinecountry]

Sources: Carlos Quentin gets 8 game suspension, Jerry Hairston Jr. 1 game suspension.
Both Quentin and Hairston are appealing their suspensions, according to sources.
Matt Kemp will not be suspended.

 

[turok]

8 whole games...wow...what a crock...lol.

Why even bother?

Doesn't really matter though...since quentin is prone to being HBP, so if he no longer can control himself, he'll be charging the mound again, soon enough.

 

[spockmaster]

8 games is fucking bullshit, it should be AT LEAST double that.

 

[Thumb]

8 games seems excessive for charging the mound.

Who was the last guy to get that many games for doing it?

 

[kalinecountry]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-b...ly-suspension-annoucement-083311649--mlb.html
Carlos Quentin?s Wikipedia page vandalized shortly after suspension announcement.
from yahoosports

 

[turok]

8 games seems excessive for charging the mound.

Who was the last guy to get that many games for doing it?

Former red sock OFer crisp received a 7-game suspension for charging the mound and tackling former rays SP shields in June of '08, and former mariner 1B sexson was suspended for 6 games for doing likewise, plus flinging his batting helmet at former ranger RP gabbard in May of '08.

But unlike greinke, apparently neither pitcher was seriously injured as a result, which is why I feel that quentin got punished much more lightly than he should have been.


Sexson issued 6-game suspension


Crisp gets seven-game suspension