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Game 16: Packers @ Lions Thread and end of season grades, reviews, etc.

ESPN ranks every team's off season. Lions come in at #29



29. Detroit Lions
What went right: The Lions went all-in on rebuilding their oft-frustrating secondary, trading cornerback Darius Slay and replacing him by signing Desmond Trufant and drafting Jeff Okudah at No. 3 overall. On paper, the trio of Okudah, Trufant and Justin Coleman would rank as one of the best cornerback combinations in the league. Trading for safety Duron Harmon completed the defensive back makeover. They will miss Slay, but even with him on the field last season, they allowed a passer rating of 97.4, which would have been the eighth-worst mark in the league.

What went wrong: Coach Matt Patricia and general manager Bob Quinn elected to rebuild most of their defense by acquiring the players Bill Belichick didn't want to keep, a move that typically turns out poorly for other teams. Jamie Collins' three-year, $30 million deal seemed particularly onerous for a linebacker who was a mess outside of New England during his run with Cleveland. The Lions will now start four former Pats on defense in Collins, Harmon, Trey Flowers and Danny Shelton. They look perilously thin along the defensive line, and while Belichick has been able to mold middling players into contributors across his front seven, Patricia's players have generally been better elsewhere than they were playing for him in Detroit.



The Lions also weren't able to parlay the No. 3 draft pick into a bidding war between the Chargers and Dolphins, forcing them to stay put. Okudah should be an impact cornerback, and I don't have any issue with them drafting him, but this team could have sorely used an extra first-round pick. Detroit used its second-round pick on running back D'Andre Swift, and while he is a talented player, this isn't a roster that can afford to use two second-round picks on running backs across three years. You could argue Kerryon Johnson is a sunk cost, but the Lions could have addressed running back with one of a number of veterans at minimal cost.

Instead, Detroit hit free agency yet again, and its deals were questionable. Trufant hasn't lived up to expectations over the past three seasons. The five-year, $45 million deal it handed Halapoulivaati Vaitai pays the former Eagles swing tackle like he is an upper-echelon starter. It sure looks reminiscent of the big deal that Detroit handed former starting right tackle Rick Wagner, which didn't work out.

What they could have done differently: Resisted the urge to go after as many former Patriots as possible. The Collins deal is a mess, and under Belichick, the Patriots have exhibited the ability to develop players such as Shelton and Harmon into useful contributors. Patricia and Quinn are trying to buy them instead. If the Lions couldn't trade down in the first round, they should have used their second-rounder on a position that's tougher to fill than halfback.


What's left to do: Add defensive line help. Detroit signed Nick Williams to a two-year deal after he impressed with the Bears in his first significant stretch of pro action as a 29-year-old, but it needs another pass-rusher to mix in on a rotational basis. I'd love to see the Lions sign Jadeveon Clowney, but more realistically, this would be a landing spot for somebody like Jabaal Sheard on the edge or Marcell Dareus on the interior. Hey, one of those guys used to play for the Patriots!
 
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Vaitai and the guards boost the run blocking big time. And yeah the Wagner deal was backloaded and they cut bait. Added Big V which has some backload too so could the contract is not a big deal. He wasn't overpaid more than any FA. He is starter quality player. Peters and Lane Johnson are just awesome tackles.. 32nd, 22nd and 17th cap hits for tackles in next 3 seasons and those will drop further down with new deals the next 3 offseasons. Got paid like a starter because he is a starter quality.

Secondary looks great and complete with depth. Like this is a top 5 secondary in the league great.

Jamie Collins is a huge upgrade. Also he is not going to play in Cleveland's dumb ass system. He is literally going to being in the Patriots system. So he should shine

Williams added is nice. But Hand is back too. Hand was a top 10 interior defender in the league in 2018. Julian Okwara upgrades over Kennard. More from Austin Bryant healthy too. Flowers full year health. Nick Williams big upgrade. Like I said before, just sack wise we increased by like 8 sacks from 2020 roster to 2019 at DT. Shelton one more than Snacks and Robinson/Atkins/Kevin Strong/Mike Daniels 1.5 sack total compared to Williams/healthy Hand/rookie DTs

Plus this team was good with a healthy Stafford. The 3 win record doesn't indicate how good the 2019 roster was.

Elite QB, good RBs, plenty of weapons, solid Oline, good Dline, upgraded LBs and a great secondary. This team has playoffs written all over it.
 
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LKP said:
Vaitai and the guards boost the run blocking big time. And yeah the Wagner deal was backloaded and they cut bait. Added Big V which has some backload too so could the contract is not a big deal. He wasn't overpaid more than any FA. He is starter quality player. Peters and Lane Johnson are just awesome tackles.. 32nd, 22nd and 17th cap hits for tackles in next 3 seasons and those will drop further down with new deals the next 3 offseasons. Got paid like a starter because he is a starter quality.

Secondary looks great and complete with depth. Like this is a top 5 secondary in the league great.

Jamie Collins is a huge upgrade. Also he is not going to play in Cleveland's dumb ass system. He is literally going to being in the Patriots system. So he should shine

Williams added is nice. But Hand is back too. Hand was a top 10 interior defender in the league in 2018. Julian Okwara upgrades over Kennard. More from Austin Bryant healthy too. Flowers full year health. Nick Williams big upgrade. Like I said before, just sack wise we increased by like 8 sacks from 2020 roster to 2019 at DT. Shelton one more than Snacks and Robinson/Atkins/Kevin Strong/Mike Daniels 1.5 sack total compared to Williams/healthy Hand/rookie DTs

Plus this team was good with a healthy Stafford. The 3 win record doesn't indicate how good the 2019 roster was.

Elite QB, good RBs, plenty of weapons, solid Oline, good Dline, upgraded LBs and a great secondary. This team has playoffs written all over it.
Click to expand...

same song and dance. LKP predicts that the team is great and then they miss the playoffs.
 
tomdalton22 said:
same song and dance. LKP predicts that the team is great and then they miss the playoffs.
Click to expand...

Great teams can miss playoffs with injuries or poor reffing against other good teams.

Lions don't always miss though either. 2011, 2014, 2016 hello

We'll see which NFC North teams wins injury roulette, gets fair ref treatment and executes on Sundays. Not even asking for refs to rule in our favor, but we are owed like 50 games really to "even" things out.

Lions top 10 health in the league wins 10 or more games. Lions top 15 health wins 10 games probably as well. And as always depends on who gets injured and if its a spot you just happen to have depth.

Tackle hurt you got Crosby. Good. Two tackles hurt, bad
Guard hurt you got Dahl. Good. Two hurt got Dahl and Wiggins.
Stafford hurt. Very bad even if Daniel is an "upgrade" over Driskel/Blough. I actually liked Driskel and with a little better defense/run game could have some a few games.

KJ or Bo hurt, we got Swift now and vice versa. KJ and Swift hurt would be bad
KG hurt bad. Marvin hurt, meh depends how many games. Amendola hurt you could easily survive.

Hand hurt. Bad but a little better than last year. Williams hurt could handl
Flowers hurt very bad.
J Okwara hurt TBD with Bryant
R Okwara could handle injury there.
Could still add at DE.
Depends on the combo.

Collins hurt bad but better than last year. Can handle Davis or Raglan or Jones or Tavai injuries now

One CB hurt could handle a starting CB injury with AO. Two hurt same time makes it tougher like any secondary as you are into Mike Ford or Daryl Roberts territory then

Safety hurt in Walker and Coleman depends on Will Harris year 2. Wouldn't mind adding a safety even Tavon Wilson back.
 
It's pretty tough when you have to mention them by a particular year.
 
tomdalton22 said:
sorry. They either miss the playoffs or get knocked out in their first game.

:clap:
Click to expand...

Due to injuries and refs

Entire secondary hurt against Drew Brees in a shoot out. Delmas had one leg, Houston out, tons of safety injuries. Aaron Berry wasn't going to stop anybody besides traffic with his gun.
Cowboys game. Yeah you know what happened.
Seattle OPI and DPI like crazy in that game. Stafford with the messed up finger. But alot of fluke drops by sure handed Lions WRs as well.
 
Barnwell bashed the pats (rank 30) for losing harmon, collins and shelton and then turn around and bash the lions for gaining them. Collins rated as a great underrated replacement too by espn

Barnwell is an idiot

Lions top 5 offseason for sure
 
LKP said:
Barnwell bashed the pats (rank 30) for losing harmon, collins and shelton and then turn around and bash the lions for gaining them. Collins rated as a great underrated replacement too by espn

Barnwell is an idiot

Lions top 5 offseason for sure
Click to expand...

He ranked the Pats because they lost Tom Brady. Then he mentioned losing Collins, Van Noy and Shelton. They did mention losing Harmon but that was in the "what went right" section of the article.

Losing those 4 members on the defense (including 3 of them to the Lions) and my guess is the Pats D will still rank well ahead of the Lions
 
He said it will hurt the Pats but also hurts the Lions even though all 3 are good players per Barnwell. His logic makes zero sense

Newsflash. Pats players are good. Flowers is a great example. Stud player HELPING the Lions. They just dont like the story line of picking up ex-Pats. Pats players play well for Detroit. Period.

Also with Covid, it helps tremendously that these players already know the system
 
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Big V 22nd ranked out of 81 tackles that qualified in 541 snaps. Wagner had a terrible grade in 2019. Big V better in pass pro and much better in run blocking. Ragnow and Decker with good grades too, Dahl above average grade, Wiggins was average. Plus two new rookies

Stafford is elite and plenty of weapons for him. KG is a stud and led league in TD catches. Marvin good year until injury and was 3rd in WRS in TDS even missing games. Amendola solid season in the slot. Hock immense potential and showed his flashes before injury.

RB stacked with KJ (5.1 YPC in 2018), Swift, Bo, Huntley and Ty Johnson

Shelton 39th out of 115. Snacks was much lower in an injured 2019
Nick Williams 55th out of 115. Much much much better than Robinson or Atkins or Strong. Plus 6 sacks crushes their production there.

Duron Harmon 18th out of 88 safeties ranked. Much higher than Diggs, Harris or Tavon Wilson. Just better than a good Tracy Walker even. Jayron Kearse had a great grade too so some backup potential and ST there.

Jamie Collins 16 out of 89 LBs. Much higher than Davis, Kennard or Christian Jones. Collins is a flat out good LB in run D, pass rush and coverage. Versatility is huge too which helps Davis and Tavai

Trufant 32 out of 112. Much higher than Slay in 2019 (82nd ranked for Slay)
Okudah>Melvin
AO graded well too
Coleman strong start then ended average for CBs. He has been good in the league

Flowers great grade even with slow start due to shoulder, Romeo Okwara was below average but solid in run D. Hand top 10 interior defender in 2018 we get that back. Add Julian Okwara and Collins to pass rush mix too. Davis blitzing more. Nick Williams and Shelton offer more than what we had. Big improvements

This team is stacked.
 
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https://lionswire.usatoday.com/2020...ed-their-pass-rushing-this-offseason-per-pff/

https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2020/4/28/21240424/pff-loves-detroit-lions-2020-nfl-draft-class

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-most-improved-defenses-after-the-2020-nfl-draft-and-free-agency

All good improvement articles. Barnwell and ESPN are idiots.

"During his seven-year NFL career, Jamie Collins’ PFF pass-rush grade of 83.1 ranks second only to Anthony Barr among NFL linebackers who have played at least 500 snaps. His 25 sacks rank first among qualifying linebackers, and his 112 total pressures over the last seven seasons rank third among players at the position. As a blitzing linebacker, he has a great feel for timing and speed to generate pressure; his versatility to function in multiple roles along with his experience in Matt Patricia’s defense makes him an upgrade in every facet of the Lions defense."

So many weapons too
https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2020...ff-rankings-receiving-corps-detroit-lions-6th
 
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